"Mirvat:About a week ago I got an email from a distant relative by marriage ----Check it out--I'm sending you the whole chain of communications:"
This relative sends the following message around asking people to think about it!
"Something to think about.
Spanish newspaper
Article on Judaism
ALL EUROPEAN LIFE DIED IN AUSCHWITZ
By Sebastian Vilar Rodrigez
I walked down the street in Barcelona, and suddenly discovered a terrible truth - Europe died in Auschwitz. We killed six million Jews and replaced them with 20 million Muslims. In Auschwitz we burned a culture, thought, creativity, talent. We destroyed the chosen people, truly chosen, because they produced great and wonderful people who changed the world. The contribution of this people is felt in all areas of life: science, art international trade, and above all, as the conscience of the world. These are the people we burned. And under the pretense of tolerance, and because we wanted to prove to ourselves that we were cured of the disease of racism, we opened our gates to 20 million Muslims, who brought us stupidity and ignorance, religious extremism and lack of tolerance, crime and poverty due to an unwillingness to work and support their families with pride. They have turned our beautiful Spanish cities into the third world, drowning in filth and crime. Shut up in the apartments they receive free from the government. And thus, in our misery, we have exchanged culture for fanatical hatred, creative skill for destructive skill, intelligence for backwardness and superstition. We have exchanged the pursuit of peace of the Jews of Europe and their determined clinging to life because life is holy, for those who pursue death, for people consumed by the desire for death for themselves and others, for our children and theirs. What a terrible mistake was made by miserable Europe.
Please forward it on."L. responds:
"I think it's interesting to note that this kind of stuff always circulates without a link or identifier of the original source. I suspect that some hate group thinks that connecting their anti-Moslem beliefs to some imaginary European source will make it seem more authentic, "cultured" etc and legitimate to "sophisticated", educated Jews in the US.
I think it'simportant to note that Islam is the world's largest religion, meaning that there are millions of quiet, industrious, peaceful family people who consider themselves to be Moslem and who are being gathered together inthese ugly generalizations. Such generalizations are meaningless to me indescribing ANY entire group of people and I consider them to resemble the anti-Semitic cartoons the Nazis used to describe the evil, dirty influences that the Jewish culture had on their "superior, innocent, virtuous Aryan people".
If this is, in fact, a real editorial from a Spanish newspaper, I would say it provides evidence that many (notice that I'm not including ALL Spaniards or Europeans in a sweeping generalization) Europeans--if not just Spaniards--haven't learned from the horrors of the Nazi era about the dangers of such racism but have simply found a new group on which to focus their anger, feelings of insecurity and bigotry. If people don't think carefully about such craziness, we will all soon be reliving the horrors of that period. More likely, I think it is an indication of where much of American (including American Jewish) consciousness, is today. G-d help us!
I would also ask Jews to recall the fact that when the rulers of Spain tossed all non-Christians off of the Iberian peninsula, it was this Moslem culture, primarily, that welcomed and tolerated the Jews and nurtured the likes of the physician named Maimonidees. The history of the European darkages is never presented in this country with the story of the Renaissance that was occurring in the Middle East among the Moslem world. You have to dig for it to realize that it wasn't primarily the catholic monks in Europe who carried the developments of ancient Greece through the dark ages to their continued development in Europe, but the continuing enlightenment in the Arab countries. It clearly suits the needs of some western bigots to forget and bury these facts and present a huge part of the world's population as being just genetically inferior.
Sorry, I'm a scientist and a well-read student of the misuse of science and statistics to rewrite history to foster hatred and bigotry. I don't drink that Koolaid as quickly as many others seem to! I have sought out and found beauty in many other cultures including those that are primarily Moslem and am always disgusted to find privileged, educated Jews who should have learned from history how dangerous it is to buy into such hateful garbage. Because of such a prevalence, I truly fear for my children and the other children of this world; the 21st century seems to be following in the violent footsteps of its predecessor. I hope you'll pass around this alternative view...but I don't expect it.
Sorrowfully yours,
L."
46 comments:
sad but true. except that the majority of people are christians and not muslims.
the article is obviously a hoax, with the intent of chain letters and stirring inter-racial disturbances. google the author name: only this article comes up, and on blogs denoucing it as fake!
the reply was far better written anyway!
Lirun i'm so sick of your comments.
the email was sent to me by a jew and she wrote the reply. if this blog goes into racist bullshit just don't fucking visit anymore. you've been already kicked out of here several times!
Amen, sweet sister Mirvat, amen.
delete away then.. but when you accuse of racism its fine..
you love the sound of your own ideas.. thats natural.. but its not enlightened..
again this email was replied to by my dear friend who a proud jew and who only wants her children to grow up in a world where they won't be associated with the actions in israel. she is not afraid to say it as it is and she laughs at people like you who hide behind name calling.. describing her reply as anti-semitic is like calling her a self-hating jew which she would be very intertained by..
i have spent some posts criticizing our internal conflicts and the problems in lebanon. i'm not afraid to face our mistakes but you will obviously never be ready to come forth with yours.
i have enjoyed and portrayed a spectrum of ideas here but yours, guilty, i don't want to listen to..
I can't beleive someone would accuse you of racism and worse. I've read these comments and your posts regularly. At times, I've disagreed with what you had to say but never doubted your fairness. Let Lirun go you're better off.
BTW I'm still not using my name for fear of his "tatics"
whatever :)
self hating jews are everywhere - the one thing have in common with non jews that hate jews is a thorough lack of appreciation of whats going on..
i suspect you dont really read my blog over coffee.. because i have often expressed disgust at the actions of my government and sorrow for the errors of our ways..
evil twin shmevil twin..
ignorance is a weird form of bliss.. enjoy it.. you seem very committed.. but i must say i am surprised because you seemed to opening up over the course of the last year..
maybe merely softened by my "manipulative and dangerous propaganda" as mone would have it :)
ps - i love it when you get fiesty..
You love it when Mirvat gets fiesty? You have a sick mind....you don't seem to realize that she isn't playing with you, she is simply disgusted with you. Your mental facilities are of the the gutter. Your people do tend to behave this way and that is sad. Only the "self-hating" Jews are worth reading about, having a discussion with, and learning from. They are the only Jews that are telling the truth. They are the only ones that are honest. And you play terrible games with mirvat by saying something so stupid like "I love it when you get fiesty".....Your no friend. No way. Friends don't talk like that. Only passive-aggressive losers like yourself talk like that.
Say, Mirvat, I just couldn't help but respond to this "friend" of yours.
Mirvat--
I'd like to know where your friend knows the article was written by a Jew because he/she responds as if a Jew wrote it or at least was written with some sort of acknowledgment of the sentiment of a sizable group of Jews.
The article appears to address a Christian-European sentiment as if to say "Look who we got rid of and look who replaced them" tone. I'm sure these feelings are growing unfortunately in Europe especially in France and Britain. However the response seems off-focussed with a nice Al-Jazeera spin to it.
"self hating jews are everywhere -the one thing have in common with non jews that hate jews is a thorough lack of appreciation of whats going on"
***************************
The actual truth: there are no such thing as "self-hating" Jews. And the reply from Mirvat's Jewish friend is most highly enlightened. I can't imagine what your excuse is. You, as Mirvat's "friend" sure don't talk like you're "enlightened". No, not at all.
snurd
L.'s response is to a family member who was passing the email around asking people to think about it. it wasn't the first time he and a bunch of her jewish friends express and encourage opinions of the sort and this is why she responds to this group of people.
Jenn, thanks :) he's no friend and not worth engaging with anymore.
i've been devalued..
like a stock dropping off the nasdaq 100 losing its institutional investors..
oh no.. tragic stuff.. nice sense of perspective :)
have a great day guys..
deja vuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuu
Mirvat--
The article is well worth discussing because such sentiment is the start of hatred. Your friend is right about the Arab world treating the Jews at least better than Christian Europe had pre-1948 at least. After 1948 however the Arabs essentially became the Christians in Europe with regard to Jews.
Muslims in Europe are quickly becoming the Jews of old. However there are important factors preventing any wide-spread anti-Muslim action by Christian Europe. Number one, Europe is ridden with Nazi guilt. Number two, Muslims have effectively spawned fear in much of Europe after some terrorist acts, foiled plots and threats of others as well as the outrage over the Danish cartoons.
I would say that sending the above article out is an excellent learning tool if that was it's intended purpose but not in a manner that would promote enrollment in those beliefs.
Poor Larabie, he's fallen off of his surfer board. Don't let the sharks take a bite on the way doooooowwwwwnnnnnnn.
surfer board ? heheheheh is that like is that like customer complaints officer counter? or do you field them all in through email and phone?
Whatcha gonna doooooo larak? Have me imprisoned on a small technicality?
How you israelis love to show off this one glaring TRUTH - the very tiny and narrow scope of your "brain-mind" assembly.....jumping on stupid details that don't mean a smidge...........it is all so very typical.
hahahahahah you are so funny.. i must admit.. this is great entertainment..
would make a fantastic sitcom!
i am curious as to how it is that you know i surf.. hmm.. could it be rhiannon that you actually secretly follow my BLOG!!
you remind me of those little girls in the second grade who would hit the boys they had a crush on.. just to disguise their admiration..
on behalf of my country - i would like to say - that i understand..
you are clearly besotted..
:D
Oh I am besotted, am I? With you? Your "country"? Yup! You got me! And here's my VALENTINE to you, sweet lirup - via another blogger from another website:
(Hope you can "feel" the luv, my dimwitted, shriveled up lizard - R)......
Paul on his reflection of John Kaminski:
"I have spent many an hour over the past couple of years researching into this whole Zionist phenomenon and from what I’ve learned it is extremely difficult to separate the wheat from the chaff when it comes to differentiating between Zionists, Jews and Gentile Zionists and so on.
In the early period of Zionism’s development one would be hard pressed to find any of the original instigators who weren’t Jews albeit of Eastern European origins and thus non-Semitic types.
I also read the threads by people purporting to be close friends of John’s (kaminski) who would then proceed to attack him with the usual ad hominem comments and overlook much of the original arguments that John has been making for years now.
I refuse to use terms like “Jew-bashing” merely because they all stem from the grammar of what I call Zionese, a set of terminology created specifically by the Zionists in order to deflect away from the basic questions that people have been asking answers to for the past 60 years.
It’s obvious that many of our leaders are not Jewish but again that doesn’t really mean anything in the context of Zionism for the simple reason that its methodology precludes having to only work with individuals of Jewish origins.
Arthur Balfour wasn’t a Jew but he was influenced to a great degree by many Jews who used various tactics to gain his confidence to the point where he was willing to support the efforts of the Zionists to steal Arab lands in later years.
Now that the debate over Zionism has finally broken out on the Internet it’s like a massive, festering wound that’s been growing and building for over a century.
It’s bound; in it’s bursting, to throw off profuse amounts of gangrenous puss that will undoubtedly fly in every direction.
But do we turn upon those who have had the courage to finally lance this gargantuan boil rather than holding to account those who have done everything possible over the last hundred years to conceal the ugliness and the negativity behind this false mask of evil that we now recognize as Zionism?
Rather than feign this indignant outrage over John’s apparent prejudice why aren’t his critics forging on past and picking up the arguments and pushing harder and harder for some accountability on the part of those Jews who ARE responsible for much of what John attributes to ALL Jews?"
_______________________________
Oh, but read on sweet lerug, there is more affectionate words via blogger Paul as he continues...........
"*Everyone, we need to ask ourselves who are the people directly responsible for the imprisonment of Revisionists like Zundel and Rudolf and Irving.
*We need to ask who owns the media and who created the devastating system known as Fractional Reserve Banking and who orchestrated the Bolshevik overthrow of the Russian Empire and so on.
*We need to accept openly that these people were Jews, are Jews and are still, thus far, not accountable for the havoc and misery that they’ve brought to the world in general and that includes the Jews who are against these issues.
On a personal note I cannot accept that every Jew is out to overthrow and take over the world. I am married into a Jewish family myself and I would be the world’s greatest hypocrite were I to espouse such a doctrine yet at the same time I also know the precarious nature of the Beast that we’re dealing with here and it is SO easy to fall into the trap of defending the innocent by denigrating those who are ultimately out to expose the ones who are screwing over the vast majority of all of us.
If it weren’t for the Jews we would not have political Zionism today and we would not have the illegal “state” of Israel which I feel was fraudulently created through subterfuge and evil design and deserves to be peacefully dismantled just as the Orthodox Judaists believe.
This bad movie has been going on for a hundred years now and the majority of Jews, be they anti-Zionist or secular or whatever, have not gathered themselves together in sufficient numbers to express their outrage over what this supposedly small elite group has been pulling off throughout all our lifetime IN THEIR COLLECTIVE NAME.
Ignorance is no longer an excuse and so I feel that the Jewish population as a whole ought to raise their voices in a chorus of disapproval that would set the rest of the world straight once and for all as to their ultimate motives.
You might think this rather naïve and unrealistic and I would agree except for the fact that it is the Jews who own and control the mainstream media and who hold within their grasp the magic wand to perform just this sort of miracle that would ensure the sincerity of their motives toward humanity as a whole and at the same time, once and for all, expose the root of this problem for all to see.
People like John Kaminski are, of necessity, extremes and therefore ultimately victims of the very evil that the rest of us sense in one degree or another but refuse to stick our necks out to expose. Rather than turning on him when we perceive him to be faltering and losing his grip on the torch of freedom it would be more courageous to grasp that falling torch and with renewed vigor raise it higher for more people to see."
______________________________
Gotta hand it to Paul. He has a great way with words. A perfect Valentines sentiment from the both of us to you, leruf.
i reckon you should video yourself in front of a mirror reading out your comments and youtube it.. you would be a superstar..
you are so funny..
like a south park character..
Can I be besotted too? Can I? Can I? Oh pretty please?
If Palestinians recognized Israel’s “right to exist,” they would legitimize all Israeli atrocities, but they would also force Israel to confront its legal vagueness. Israel might even have to adopt a constitution with clearly defined rights. Thus, an acknowledgement of Israel’s “right” would cause Israelis to lash out even more violently, in order to protect their vagueness.
Mirvat,
I actually didn't see what your friend wrote as anti-Semitic. However, she did gloss over the history of the Jews in Arab lands. Yes, at certain times Jews did receive better treatment in Arab lands than Christian ones, but the entire picture is very complicated and also tragic. But she was right in everything else she wrote. We cannot allow such prejudice to rise against any group of people. I've experienced anti-Semitism and it's awful, and as Jews especially we should know better.
We all need to interact with people from other cultures, otherwise they are all just objects to us. We'll never see human faces...and this is where blanket statements become "acceptable."
I also want to tell you I was absolutely horrified at Israel's conduct during the war this past summer. Attacking Hizbolla is one thing, but attacking an entire nation is another. Cluster bombs, grain silos, milk plants...etc...sorry, but I just fail to see these things as part of the battle.
I disagree with a lot on your blog concerning Israel otherwise, however, I see that you listen to other people, and I think you're a good person, Mirvat.
I don't want to debate politics. We’ll never agree, and I personally feel everyone is too polarized - especially considering recent events - and we'll have to wait a very long time for things to get any better between our nations…It’s just not happening. I've given up trying to reach political understandings with people. But I do hope your country rebuilds even more beautifully this time around, and you're able to return to the Lebanon you've always dreamed of. I really do respect the love you have for your country.
The Ashkenazi Jews are not semitic and they are not european either. They are Turanians, descendants of judaised Khazars and other finno-turko-mongol tribes from the eurasian steppes.
This misnomer, anti-"semite" grates on my nerves......Not only do I refuse to acknowledge it, I will tell you all right NOW:
'you mean anti-TURANIAN', to all Zionist (or philo-Zionist) detractors.....some of us know who zionists really are - FALSE JEWS.
KHAZARS.
Well, actually I'm only part Ashkenazi, therefore the term anti-Semitic - despite my white complexion you saw - is applicable to a certain degree if we use your definition, thank you. I was just relating to what L. had written - she had also used the term anti-Semitic to refer to Nazi attacks - and for some reason I highly doubt the Nazis were targeting Mizrachi Jews. When L. used this term, nothing was said before I commented. You are right that this term does not only apply to Jews, so I'm sorry if this offended you and will change it to anti-Jewish.
In the meanwhile I will try to the best half fake-Jew-Khazar-whatever I can be. When I become a member of the Knesset, maybe pointing out my "Ashkenazi" skin-tone will be more effective. I'm not a fan of various things my government does either, so I don't know how calling me a "Khazar" is going to help. I still live here, bottom line.
There are actually different theories as to where the Ashkenazim originated. One is that Ashkenazim originated in the Middle East and immigrated to France at the start of the Common Era. If Ashkenazim were descended from Khazars - Judaism is a religion, so converts are just as Jewish as Jews from birth, they cannot be "fake." The religious definition of a Jew has nothing to do with Zionists or Israel - the religious definition has existed for thousands of years. You don't have to agree with this definition, but it's there and it's how Jews define ourselves.
I wasn't there at the start of Ashkenazi Jewry, so I don't know where they come from.
I haven't got anything else to say on the topic.
Jennifer--
German political agitator Wilhelm Marr coined the related German word Antisemitismus in his book "The Way to Victory of Germanicism over Judaism" in 1879. Marr used the phrase to mean hatred of Jews or Judenhass, and he used the new word antisemitism to make hatred of the Jews seem rational and sanctioned by scientific knowledge. Marr's book became very popular, and in the same year he founded the "League of Antisemites" ("Antisemiten-Liga"), the first German organization committed specifically to combatting the alleged threat to Germany posed by the Jews, and advocating their forced removal from the count (Wikipedia)
Regarding Khazars...many did convert to Judaism around 940 AD. Does it matter? How many Palestinians today were Jews then? Probably a lot more than you wish to know. Does any of this matter now?
"Antisemitic" is a word that the zionists carefully chose to accomplish several goals: It denigrates their opposition, it implies a unified philosophy between Hebrews, jews, zionists, and sabbateans, and most importantly, it usurps the Semitic bloodline for exclusive use by “European” ashkinazics and sephardics with the implied usurpation of the land and biblical blessings promised to the Semitic children of Abraham, which are NOT the ashkenazi jews/khazar descendants of today.
I completely reject "antisemetic" because it is a political tool, not a verb, noun, or adjective. I refuse to use it or acknowledge it.
I also reject the term "holocaust" when it refers to whatever happened in Europe between 1939 and 1945. There have been so many genocides in human history that none of them deserve to be singled out as "THE holocaust". They were all horrible. All kinds of people suffered and died, not just 'jews"............millions of people from other faiths died too.
For people to finally, one day, reject this thing "antisemetic" and see it for what it really is (a ploy to play games with the minds of uninformed people) would be highly commendable.
This word "antisemetic" is a misnomer...so is the word "holocaust"......historically they make no sense.
Lidar said:
however, I see that you listen to other people, and I think you're a good person, Mirvat.
***********
You are right, Lidar. You come to the very right place teeming with very good persons. One just can hardly find a nicer bunch of folks.
;)
yeah great team.. people who reject the holocaust.. reject the existence of antisemitism and basically "really know" how it is..
some awesome listeners :) real communicators.. who mangle your name as they hide in anonymity..
You can play your twisted games all you want. What a shame. For every game you play people die. So true. What wicked games you zionist Khazars have played all this time.
Sure Antisemiticism exists. I would say that most israelis ARE antisemetic, considering the support they give to their terrorist KHAZAR military, considering the thousands of SEMETIC Lebanese and Palestinians, this israeli terrorist ANTISEMETIC army massacres annually.
Who's telling the truth? Who's playing games with other people's lives and well being? Who's distorting, exaggerating, and stretching the meaning of "anti-semetic" all for a piece of land - based on bogus biblical shams?
Thanks Jennifer. Well Done.
Here ya go Lerum,
another valentines card
for you:
It can be strongly argued that
Sharon represents the
long-term policy of all
Israeli governments,
without any obscuring fluff
or verbal embroidery.
For example: Ben-Gurion approved
the terror missions of Unit 101.
Every Israeli government has
condoned settlements and
building around Jerusalem.
It was Labor's Ehud Barak who okayed
the military escort for Sharon on his
provocative sortie that sparked
the second Intifada and Barak
who has overseen the
lethal military repression.....
But that doesn't diminish
Sharon's sinister shadow
across the past half century.
That shadow is better evoked by
Palestinians and Lebanese
grieving for the dead,
the maimed,
the displaced, or by
a young Israeli woman,
Ilil Komey, 16, who confronted Sharon
when he visited her agricultural
high school outside Beersheva.
"you sent my father into Lebanon", Ilil said.
"Ariel Sharon, I accuse you
of having made me suffer
for 16 some odd years.
I accuse you of having made
my father suffer for over 16 years.
I accuse you of a lot of things
that made a lot of people suffer
in this country.
I don't think that you
can now be elected as prime minister".
Ilil was wrong. He was.
And the bloodbath goes on........
Jeffrey St. Clair
2001
well all so interesting.. i am quite fascinated by canadian authoriship.. particularly that of irshad manji
http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/story/0,20867,21194124-7583,00.html
go rhiannon.. read what this guy has to say.. i feel funny calling you that.. you dont even have a genuine online presence..
i challenge you to respond specifically to the points this guy makes..
Lirun, i have never known anyone as bipolar as you are!!!
you must be looking at things from a wonderful perspective to see it that way..
i admit you're not the first..
:)
The surest way to corrupt a youth is to instruct him to hold in higher esteem those who think alike than those who think differently. - Friedrich Nietzsche
Irshad Manji is a zionist. A false moslem. WTF! Why doesn't she get it over with and become an Israeli, live in Israel and adopt Zionism. You'd be surprised how many Muslims and Christians actually know what a phoney Manji is. Naturally she is embraced by the media like walid shoebat. Manji and Shoebat are cowards. Lirun, have you any idea how many of your ASHKENAZI KHAZAR people are continually bringing up Irshad Manji in dialogue? Manji loves her Ashkenazi Khazars.
The real problem doesn't lie with irshad manji and hateful, moslem-smearing types like her, but rather the system that panders to her and her type.
Poor little rich manji! The Ashkenazi Khazars, aka False Jews, have set her up well. All for the benefit of zionism. We understand you well, Lirun. Very, very well.
ibki aleiki ya habla
:)
Why doesn't Jennifer just stick with "Rhiannon"?
Why doesn't snurdly just stick with "Lirun"?
Why don't "snurdly" and
Lirun" stick with Ashkenazi Khazars instead of "Israelis"?
Is the truth too hard for you to handle, snurdly?
hehe
maybe im not ashkenazi..
Jennifer/Rhiannon has shown me the painful truth, which I cannot bear...that I may be descended from the Khazars! I can't sleep at night now...just toss and turn. I'm not even sure I can live with myself. Help!!
Arthur Koestler, The Thirteenth Tribe
According to the article ‘Statistics’ in the Jewish Encyclopaedia, in the 16th century the total Jewish population of the world amounted to about one million. This seems to indicate, as Poliak, Kutschera and others have pointed out, that during the Middle Ages the majority of those who professed the Judaic faith were KHAZARS. A substantial part of this majority went to Poland, Lithuania, Hungary, and the Balkans, where they founded that Eastern Jewish community which in its turn became the dominant majority of world Jewry. Even if the original core of that community was diluted and augmented by immigrants from other regions, its predominantly KHAZAR—TURKISH derivation appears to be supported by strong evidence……….
________________________________________________
snurdly/lirun, hello you Khazar, you NON-semetic, False Jew. Have it your way. I see that Rhiannon is popular, even famous among your people. I came across another blog where you talk about her quite jealously.
The way I see it you deserve to be called a False Jew, a Khazar. If you really want to live in a safe world and not get blown up then move back to Poland, Russia, Hungary….you can even go back to New York City. Turkey will take you back. Plenty of Jews live there in peace and harmony among the Christians and Muslims. They won’t hurt you there. You show such mean-spiritedness and low-minded behavior on this blog, how can you possibly dare to say you come in the name of peace and friendship? That is just plain sick and twisted.
You call people cowards who are anonymous, yet by your very own words you are clearly the true coward because all you do is hurl insults and provide false information and threaten people. You say you have written to your government and rallied for peace. I actually believe you, but after reading your crap laden posts, I think its all for show with no substance behind it. I don't believe you really care and it really does cause you considerable revulsion to have to admit that Israel has become a pariah after what it did to Lebanon. Yes Khazar snurdly/lirun, i am sure you sleep very well. Is that really your face up there? Yup! PURE KHAZAR. Don't look like a semite to me.
hitit magnuna..
........I'd just like to also mention as a side note that many of the israeli soldiers maimed or killed in southern lebanon received their injuries from land mines they had left behind (for lebanese farmers and children to find) when they illegally occupied southern lebanon for 18 years.............now that is crazy.
Israel's worst enemy is itself. What goes around comes around. Khazar/ashkenazi, snurdly/lirun has nothing good to say.
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